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A post from RAWK - Konchesky, Roy and beyond...

Discussion in 'General LFC Discussion' started by F@ces, Sep 3, 2010.

  1. Derekc

    Derekc
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    well said. it doesn't always need to descend into a pro rafa/anti rafa, pro roy/anti roy arguement
     
  2. Shay

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    well said also;)
     
  3. serpheus

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    Good post but i still think he isn't giving Roy a decent chance and for some reason he thinks Pelligrini is some kind of magician who can sort out all the clubs problems with 20 million quid.
     
  4. redabbey

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    Excellent post 'intorresting' sums up my own thoughts exactly. Except I was in the 'pro Rafa camp'. However now that we have a new manager I desperately want Roy to succeed. Sunday's game where Liverpool were not in control of the possession for a lot of the match though have left me worried.
     
  5. Shay

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    The two managers simply represent two possible approaches the club could have taken;

    1. Hire a manager to steady the ship for the short term with no major outlay until the club is sold and a new owner will at that point hire a manager they want

    2. Hire a manager, give him the financial backing with a view to remain at the club for 5+ years

    The club is for sale, we were never going to make any major long term change with a view to bringing in new owners who will without doubt have their own plans for the club.

    I think the original posters is simply talking about the club and where it is rather now and it's approach rather than manager v manager. They are just representations on how the club has changed in its approach.

    Do you believe Roy is a long term appointment? If we're sold in the next six months I'd be very surprised if he's still here next season. That's nothing at all against Roy and he has my full support, thats simply how I see it right now.
     
  6. serpheus

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    Hopefully.
     
  7. stevieg05

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    I thought most of the comment was rubbish. Totally over the top negativity.
    We all know the state of the club of the club at the moment thats fair enuf.

    But with insua.....we tried to sell him, got 1 or 2 offers but he couldn't agree personal terms. At least by loaning him out we have got rid of his wages. If he had stayed this season how many games would he have played? He'd be behind Konchesky, Aurelio, Agger, and probably even Kelly for the left back spot in my book. So totally pointless keeping him. I know he's only 21 but last season he was beyond bad, ive never seen a full back get skinned so often!

    Konchesky seems to be gettin a lot of stick. I think he's going to turn out to be a very good signin for us! A good attacking English full back. Only time will tell I suppose.

    Roy as well, give the man a break! He is a very good manager. I really wouldn't have liked to have seen another Spanish manager come in straight after Rafa. Roy is the right man for the job imo.

    We may have lost Yossi and Masch but overall since Roy has come in I think we have improved our squad from last season. A much better left back in Konchesky, a better player than Yossi in Joe Cole, and although not a better player than Masch.....Meireles isn't as defensive so should give a better balance to the team when he plays in the same startin 11 as Lucas.

    On a side note, I think its a bit ridiculous postin comments that are from another forum. If we wanted to see comments on another forum we would go there ourselves. And its unfair on E2K as he can't respond to anythin we write on here.
     
    #27 stevieg05, Sep 3, 2010
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2010
  8. dubit10

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    It's not anti Roy in any way at all.
     
  9. F@ces

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    Intorresting / Shay - excellent posts.

    @stevieg05 - No need for melodramatics :) Im sure E2K would be delighted by some of the fantastic, well-written posts in reply.
     
  10. SUPERFAN

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    The club may be "for sale" but I wouldn't read too much in to that.mike ashley said the barcodes were up for sale about a year ago but he's still there.he only said that to take the heat off him for a while after they were relegated and it worked.
    G+t have done exactly the same,nobody knows what's going to happen but I wouldn't be surprised at all if RBS refinance and g+t are still at the wheel this time next year..
     
  11. MR KING KENNY

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    seems more or less pro rafa,
    rafa was bringing the club forward and now we have a manager thats happy just to be here, why loan out insua? cos hes muck well in my eyes he is.
    rafa treating players was unreal, never really gave benny or babel a break, and neg football we had to watch, buying a player for 20million to warm the bench, playing lucas and masc together for a whole season and a blind man could tell you it never really worked, everyweek looking at the team sheet and scartching your head thinking what the **** is rafa playing at, well he got 6million he done well but he should have gone 2 years before that, wanting to sell one of the best passers in the game so he could get barry, 2 mistakes yeah right, getting kncked out of cups by weak teams.
    now we have a new manager and people are already have a dig at him, give him time thats something the man should get. theres 2 ways to look at things.
     
  12. 7Cannibal-9Asbo

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    Why does it always have to end up as a Pro/Anti Rafa argument here. The original post only mentioned his name and its already starting. Can we not just talk about the actual point of what was written rather than picking out another way to turn this into another pro/anti Rafa thread

    Rant over.
     
  13. MR KING KENNY

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    sorry mate if it sounds like a rant, but like i said it sounds like a pro rafa letter,
    buy that letter it makes out roy just as a stand in, to keep our head above water and thats his job, like a fulham, get the boat on that.
    its just the start of the season and roy is trying his best with that mess rafa left behind.
    i dont see our club as trying to keep our head above water, were much better than that.
     
  14. stevieg

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    Thats exactly Roy's role and the only reason he is here - to steady the ship while we are up sh1t creek.


    Why else do you think Purslow appointed a YES man?
     
  15. MR KING KENNY

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    id say hes here to get the team going again, players did not play for rafa lets see if they play for roy,
     
  16. 7Cannibal-9Asbo

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    I think he is here to steady the ship, he may win a few trophies while he is here but I can't see it being either the Champions League or Premier League. I support Roy 100% but realistically I know that while the team is making profits in transfer windows that Roy isn't being supported in a way that can bring us success.

    The original post used managers as an example, which is whats caused all this pro/anti manager stuff. Another way to look at it is players brought in. During the start of the Benitez era, pre-Yanks and when the Yanks spent money to win the fans over we signed Masch (18 mil), Alonso (10.75 mil), Reina (6 mil), Torres (20.2 mil), Agger (5.8 mil), Skrtel (6.5 mil), Sissoko (5.6 mil), Johnson (17.5 mil) etc. Coming towards the end of the Benitez era and now the beginning of Hodgson's era we've signed Dossena (7 mil), Riera (8 mil), Poulsen (4 mil), Cole (free), Meireles (11.5 mil), Koncheskey (3 mil) etc.

    The difference between those two lists is the difference in our ambitions, the first list shows a club looking to advance, looking to return to the success we are famous for. The other list, apart from Cole can be broken down into failures(Doss and Riera) and players brought in to fill the voids left by players leaving and not being replaced. I do think in Hodgson's case he's done the best he can to address the problem areas in the squad but it's hard to ignore the fact that if the team had money and a board of directors more worried about the numbers on the pitch rather than the numbers in their wallets our signings would be completely different and its possible that a lot of the players who left what was once "the greatest midfield in the world" might still be here and we'd be an entirely different team now.
     
  17. himalaya joe

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    What makes it pro/anti rafa is that when people have their say bout rafas acheivements it's "good post" and "that's what I was thinkin". But when someone states rafas mistakes and there are some, it's all of a sudden anti/pro rafa again.
    And the comments about "straw man arguments" "not facing reality" and learning to ignore it" stinks of arrogance.
    Fair enough rafa did a good job under very difficult circumstances but shying away from his mistakes is hardly facing reality. His treatment of some players was disgraceful. I won't go into anyting else because itl just prolong the so called pro anti rafa debate.
    Why would pelligrini have been better than roy?
    Yes he came 2nd in la liga but anyting below that with the team he had would have been a disaster, other than that outside of south America all ha has won is a intertoto cup with villareal so what makes him better
     
  18. GaryMc

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    I promised I would not get into Rafa debate, however Kev 1 year before he left Rafa got the team to 2nd in league with points that would have won the league in almost every other season of the Premiership:confused::confused::confused: so I dont see your logic in that he should have left two years earlier than he did
     
  19. Gerry

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  20. 7Cannibal-9Asbo

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    I don't mean to use Pellegrini as the sole example of a top manager but just to show where we were aiming when we appointed our manager. Also Pellegrini at 56 is the type of Manager at 56 who is young enough to begin what is going to be a long drawn out process in making Liverpool a success again whereas at 63 the chances of Roy still being in management in 5 or 6 years is much slimmer. I'm only using Pellegrini as an example here, not saying sack Roy in the morning and get him in. I'm more than happy with Roy, but I know he's not the long term solution to our problems, he can get us success but he can't keep us as a successful team for years to come.
     

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