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Ticket info/questions/discussions

Discussion in 'Tickets' started by xRedmanLFCx, Feb 21, 2019.

  1. xRedmanLFCx

    xRedmanLFCx
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    I think we should set up a thread for this, to avoid clogging up match based ticket threads. If ye don't think so, moderator's can delete this thread.

    We can put our posts here about any of the following:

    Discussions on prices of tickets per block in the stadium, per competition/game, and increase in prices from previous years to now.

    Questions or discussions on loyalty for different competitions, home and away, and it's change from previous years to now. Discussions on whether it will/should change or not in the future.

    Info and discussions on refunds and returns, how fast it can happen and how much money you will get back.

    Questions about the club rules, regarding replacement of membership cards, error with payment, duplicate or paper tickets, and proof of ID and address for local sales.
     
  2. LFCS8

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    I was just reading about a quick select option when going for tickets in the additional member sales, was wondering if anybody knows where that option is when buying the tickets, I’ve never seen it when I’ve gone to buy tickets I’ve just selected the seats manually never had much luck
     
  3. HappyRed

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    I'm sure there are much better people to offer a response but anyways... I've not seen that options before. For the General sales if you get in early enough (I assume when there is good availability) you just pick the number of tickets rather than selecting the tickets, or at least that is the way it was for me in Nov sale when I got in with no waiting time. I had another window open after 20 minutes of a wait and I had to go in and select the individual seats. In additional sales I have also got in with no wait but not seen the same option. You always have the option in the sales page on the right had side to select the stand and then # of seats and then buy (without going in and selecting individual seats) - maybe this is what you are taking about.
     
  4. xRedmanLFCx

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    I'm surprised the late sale for Burnley today was still available for about 10 minutes. Every game in the last few months has been sold out in a minute.
     
  5. Niall

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    Supporters attending the latest fans forum have reviewed a revised version of Liverpool Football Club’s sanctions and investigations processes as part of an ongoing review.

    The stadium fans forum, which took place ahead of the home game against Bournemouth on Saturday February 9, and was attended by eight forum members and four representatives from the club. Given his previous involvement in the review, Spirit of Shankly chair James McKenna was also invited to participate. The meeting lasted for approximately 90 minutes.

    The meeting began with an overview by chief operating officer Andy Hughes who reiterated why the review was considered necessary and what progress he believes has been made. He said: “As a recap, it was clear that there were significant gaps in the process and that was something which we needed to address.

    “The review into the process is ongoing and I think it is also clear that it is already much better but, equally, over the last six months we have also learned some difficult lessons which will hopefully stand us in good stead going forward.

    “During that period we have had a significant step up in the level of activity by our investigations team and, although this work is absolutely necessary given some of the challenges we are facing, we are aware that we have made some mistakes.

    “Some of the cases have been particularly difficult and there have been errors but the rate of error is low and we are aiming to be error free because, obviously, that is in the best interests of the club and our supporters.”

    Head of operations Simon Smith then provided a presentation which outlined both the types of investigation which have taken place and a range of statistical data relating to how many investigations have taken place and on how many occasions the sanctions process led to an appeal.

    He said: “As things stand, 970 individual accounts have been subject to investigation. Six of these cases have led to an appeal with a further two appeals to follow. Twenty of the cases have involved behaviour inside the stadium, shared between a small number of cases of racial discrimination, disability discrimination, missile throwing, drink related disorder and foul and abusive behaviour.

    “By far the biggest proportion of cases has involved unauthorised selling of match tickets which has resulted in almost 650 accounts being investigated. In addition, a total of 1,190 accounts are currently suspected to have been harvested in order for tickets to be sold on the secondary market with 589 of these cases being the subject of a police fraud investigation.

    “To put you in the picture as fully as I possibly can without compromising any ongoing investigations, we are aware that we have what I would describe as touting crack houses in the area. On top of that, a Northern police force came across an individual with access to 270 of our accounts and there was a separate instance in which an individual was found with 500 envelopes containing Members’ cards at a city centre hotel. The individual involved has been banned.”

    Andy Hughes said: “There is no question that Liverpool Football Club is one of the biggest targets for touts. The club has stated that it will do everything in its power to combat ticket touting and the figures and issues that Simon has highlighted underlines this commitment.”

    Operations manager Michael Yorke added: “It is important to stress that in not one single case has a sanction been issued for someone innocently passing tickets on.”

    Seeking clarification on the headline figure, forum members Goronwy Brooks asked how it been possible to investigate and process 970 separate cases since the start of the 2018-19 season. Simon Smith responded that the 970 figure related to the number of individual accounts that had been investigated and confirmed that in many instances they were investigated in multiples as that was how they were owned.

    Senior solicitor Neil Morgan then outlined the new processes detailing the proposed changes that have been made to it since the stadium forum was last held. Reiterating that there has been a move away from suspensions pending investigations, Neil Morgan stressed that the priority of the review has been to make the process “as robust and fair as possible.”

    He said: “The most visible change to the document regards the language used. In the first draft, the relevant offences were listed in categories but we feel it more appropriate that they are listed in groups. Similarly, in Group D, which relates to the unauthorised selling of match tickets, the word “transfer” has been removed because it was ambiguous and we did not want to worry about legitimately passing tickets on to friends and family.

    “In terms of the process itself, it has three main stages. The first is obviously the investigation. The second is the sanctions panel with a key change being that anyone who finds themselves under investigation will now have access to information relating to the case at that stage. The third stage is the appeal and another significant change has been made in that area as we have now invited a senior representative from the Football Supporters Federation (FSF) to join the panel as an independent member.”

    Goronwy Brooks asked whether all of the available evidence could be made available to an individual who is under investigation. Neil Morgan responded: “It will be all of the evidence subject to what we can legally provide as we have to adhere to data protection laws.”

    James McKenna said: “There is a balance to be struck as far as the process is concerned. I understand why you would not want all of the evidence to be made available before a case goes to sanction but there could and should be an intermediate stage.

    “As it stands, it looks like supporters – and the club for that matter – are having to unpick certain situations that could have been resolved much earlier. There must be a compromise that allows evidence to be provided earlier and in doing so you might well reduce your own workload while also lessening the burden on supporters who, if armed with the relevant information, might well be able to prove that they have no case to answer.

    “I accept there is a workload issue which has to be factored into your considerations but, when it comes down to it, that is either a resource issue and you need more staff in order to carry out so many investigations and do so thoroughly or else it is underlines that you need to be more selective about the cases that you choose to investigate.”

    Forum member Jayne Page said: “People who have made a mistake, particularly if it’s an unintentional mistake, will wish to come and defend themselves. Do you make this kind of recourse available to them?”

    Responding to both, Andy Hughes said: “We are going to do a resourcing review. Clearly it makes sense to do that, particularly given the volume of cases is so great. In terms of evidence, what information is made available and when it is made available, there are judgement calls to be made. As Jay rightly pointed out, it is about striking the right balance.”

    James McKenna said: “My concern in this process is not the guilty ones, it is the innocent ones, the people who have come to me and who have ended up with no case to answer.”

    Andy Hughes replied: “We are trying to find that balance. A revision of cases will help in this respect and Jay has privately suggested to me that a workshop in which we review some of the cases would be helpful. I agree with him on that and I think that would be a positive step forward.”

    Referring to changes to the appeals panel, Neil Morgan said: “We have added an independent member to the panel. There will now be four members, including three from the club, and in the event of a split verdict the casting vote would go to the independent.

    “We have also changed the time period in which an appeal should take place. Instead of allowing the club 28 days to hear an appeal, it will now happen within 14 days in keeping with a proposal put forward by this forum.”

    Forum member Frank Chart asked: “Given there have only been a total of eight appeals to date – and I’m sure we’d all agree that isn’t a high number – why can’t someone come in to have their appeal heard in person?” Jayne Page agreed, adding: “Where necessary you could always do it by conference call.”

    Andy Hughes replied: “Our position is that we operate a documentary appeal and that is consistent with the rest of the Premier League. It also adheres to the standard set by the Independent Football Ombudsman.”

    James McKenna said: “I don’t see why you say ‘Others don’t do it so we won’t do it.’ Surely as Liverpool Football Club you have the ability to come to your own conclusions and not just go with the crowd? In a workplace, you would have the opportunity to appeal in person and the same principle should apply to the football industry. I also think that sitting in the room with a person can actually defuse a situation because the individual has been able to have their say.”

    Frank Chart added: “Giving supporters the right to request a personal hearing but at the club’s discretion could be the way forward because I think everyone would respect that there may be instances in which this wouldn’t be appropriate.”

    Andy Hughes replied: “I accept the points that have been made and I will take them away with me. But I would also say that we have gone from nowhere to having a very strong process in a very short space of time and I would like to recognise the efforts of those on this forum and other supporters who have worked with us and helped us to reach this point.”

    Frank Chart said: “I agree that this is a step forward but I would suggest that as well as having a document that puts offences into groups it would be helpful if there could also be an accompanying flow chart.”

    At the conclusion of the forum, Andy Hughes agreed to hold a workshop at the next available opportunity at which a selection of cases will be reviewed.


    https://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/announ ... -fan-forum
     
  6. GaryMc

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    Wonder is there and conincidence in this meeting and then for Watford game the checks on cards on entry was a lot higher than last few months
     
  7. Pfoley

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    Didnt notice anything at all at Watford. what kind of checks Gary? That the actual card holder was using it or where cards not scanning?From Nialls post above and especially the line "It is important to stress that in not one single case has a sanction been issued for someone innocently passing tickets on.” it seems to be certain cards been targeted and not the likes of people on here innocently passing a spare on here and there and swapping cards without any kind of profit so it can only be a good thing the work the club seems to be doing. Having access to 270 accounts is mental!!
     
  8. Niall

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    Block B in the Kop according to some. Made people stand back a bit from the turnstiles and checked them all one by one as they came forward. According to one fella the steward told him they have been instructed to do these checks.
     
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  9. Niall

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    Have seen a lot of business being done in a hotel at Queens Square myself this season!
     
  10. AWB89

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    Just out of interest, is it basically impossible to get on the away tickets ladder? How is a new member meant to get a ticket and build credits when all the sales are gone at 5 or 4 away credits? Just give up?
     
  11. Beanokelly

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    It's a closed shop a lot people got on the ladder because hodgey was manager and we were shit
     
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  12. AWB89

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    The only thing he did for some of us?

    Not the hero we wanted but the hero we deserved?
     
  13. mallifornia red

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    It might be an idea for them to have a non local sale for the aways. Give a percentage of tickets that people with no away history can either register their interest for or just have it as a general sale. Impossible to get on the ladder as it stands
     
  14. xRedmanLFCx

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    I agree. But the danger with that is that it would give a chance to touts to start buying tickets and get on the ladder that way, without ever having an intention of going.
     
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  15. xRedmanLFCx

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    As Beano said, loyalty goes back as far as Roy Hodgson's era. And that's fine, theoretically it should be on loyalty.

    The problem with it being multiple years ago, means that for teenagers (like me at the time) who don't have the money to purchase flights, trains, tickets etc for an away match at short notice, will then not be on the loyalty scheme 10 years later when they do have the money to do so. Do you wait until you're in your 30s or 40s to be able to afford to join the ladder and go to an away match?
     
  16. Horan01

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    Touts (including many season ticket holders/members) are already buying and selling vast amounts of tickets for away games for hugely inflated prices, you dont have to look too far around the away stand this season to see all the people that have bought tickets in the black market from season ticket holders / members. I spoke with a group of Norwegians at West Ham away & a group of Chinese beside me in Watford away, they bought 5 tickets from a season ticket holder in Liverpool for £200 a ticket. My point is that even having the purchase requirements high for away games, wont stop touting
     
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  17. xRedmanLFCx

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    It won't stop touting, and I know it is already there. My point was that opening the door to people who aren't on the ladder, could invite more touts. At least fans who are on the ladder can swap them around with friends at face value at the moment.

    But if you have spotted a lot already who are paying touts, maybe re-opening the doors and letting new people on the ladder could reduce touting instead of increase it like I was suggesting!

    There is not really any way of stopping touts at the moment, but I hope they do open the ladder (especially for youths) as I suggested above.
     
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  18. xRedmanLFCx

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    From the Burnley thread:

    @redabbey they hardly keep empty seats? I can see why they're waiting on late hospitality purchases, but do these always sell out if they're not sold 2 days before the game?
     
  19. paulwex

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    These are seats in the middle tier in the lounges. They wont release them they only release the off site hospo when the seats are upper annie or wherever
     
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  20. redabbey

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    Your question has already being answered above, but just to confirm seats in the specific hospitality areas in the new Main Stand will be left empty if unsold. They are never ever available on general admission.
     
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